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Waterd

Optional rules

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Hi, one of my problems with the IOS version of the game is that playing with optional rules isn´t possible, many times, unlike on Vassal or real life.

Is there a chance to offer players to play games with optional rules of their choice? 

As to what those rules would be, it´s a discussion in itself, but I think it´s moot to discuss which would be good optional rules to have, without even knowing if it´s a possibility to offer this to the players.

 

But just to give two examples of what im talking about (these are not actual proposals, just concepts to give an idea what i´m talking about):

-Infinite turns: Sometimes games tend to go to an infinite amount of turns (which is actually turn 200 where the app crashes). An optional rule to prevent such a thing for example could be :Game ends on turn 30, and the game declares a winner based on summoner wounds or similar.

-Self attacking: Many people have expressed disgust to the fact that people kill their own units, and been talked several times that killing your own units SHOULD NOT Give you mana. I play like that on vassal and real life but can´t on ios. An example of optional rule would be to have friendly units killed by friendly attacks to go to discard pile instead of magic pile.

 

Alternative rules have existed in ports of board games and in computer tactical and strategic game. it would be nice to have those options so people can play with the rules they feel more comfortable with. Is there a possibility of this happening? Knowing that would fire a new discussion of which optional rules would be nice to have.

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These are some great options to implement into the game Waterd, I can tell you have been thinking about these for a while.

 

I will be sure to report both of these suggestions to our teams to see if these are something we can offer you in any upcoming expansions. If you think of any more please share them with us, and I would love to also see how many other people agree with these suggestions or have their own to add.

 

Thanks! 

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Ok, you gave me hope that is a possiblity!.

So I´m going to bring the whole topic.

This has been a controversial topic in Summoner wars. Many players feel the game is more enjoyable with some optional rules, this is a common trend in board gaming, and a game as played in multiplayer as SW has not been the exception. 

 

I of course think that players should be able to enjoy on IOS the game with the original rules. But as I said overtime certain ¨problems¨ have come up that people agreed and cope up on their own way. But it would be really nice to have the option to play with some optional rules on the IOS that would make summoner wars a better experience for some people.

 

Problems that I think the community mostly agree and I think many people would like as optional rule are the following:

- Neverending games: It´s been hotly debated on the community about what to do with those situations where nobody wants to attack. Because of it´s existence some players have meet the dreadfull ¨200 turn crash¨. What is going on in these situations in current tournaments is that someone gets bored so they attack or someone is running out of time so he has to attack or get timed out. I think none of them are optional. And recent discussion has shown many of the top players agree this is a problem they just live with.

So I think many tournament players, would like an optional tournament rule to deal with this problem.

The most common accepted rule I´ve used in tournaments is ¨If a player does nothing but move, that players loses the game¨. Personally I know some people are ok with this rule and I would hope other tournament players would come up on front here to backup my petition.

 

However despite that is the most accepted rule, that is not imo the best. 

Here are the two rules that I use:

In real life I use

¨Decaying walls¨ : At the draw phase, a player that doesn´t draw a card, must place a wound marker on a wall or summoner he controls.

 

In IOS since I can´t do that I generally play to X number of turns (somehwere between 20-30) and at the end of those the player with more walls wins, with several tiebreakers (More wall health, more summoner health and more total summon health).

I´m all up for elegance, I think there should be only ONE optional rule to deal with this situation, but I think it´s the most important optional rule, Ive seen several people just leave the game  after having his first neverending game.

 

- Attacking your own units:

This has been brought up since day 1 of SW and I know people me including that play with either no units friendly attack to friendly attack kills still go to opponent magic pile. Another point that I know bothers many people, if you join IOS For first time people frequently get dazzled by finding his opponent Ellien is killing all his commons on first turn. 

However Attacking it´s own units should be allowed because units like MV brutes and yet to come Cave goblins Oaf.

Imo so far the best rule is that cards destroyed as a result of a friendly wound marker, should go to the discard pile instead of the magic pile imo.

This optional rule is not so important imo. But I know most people really dislike this aspect of the game, I know many people play in real life this way, and I could bet my money that if this optional rule is added online it would become an instant classic for most people.

 

Deckbuilding rules:

Many tournaments have been using different deckbuilding rules for fun etc, and I don´t think optional enforced rules are really needed since people can arrange that before the game starts pretty easily, however some would be welcome (Random decks, no mercs, no extra commons, Just base decks, etc)

I think A PREGAME chat would be really good for that regard.

It would be very nice to be able to have the option to edit the deck once a player knows the opponent faction. Notice that this method of deckbuilding has been used already at live tournaments (i think it was gencon? Not sure). So clearly it has great acceptance. Right now people willing to play this way need to inform the other player previously the faction via forums, skype or other methods.

 

****

 

Now with that we finished the rules that I think the community will back me up and I think are on demand. I will move on the optional rules that are just very personal suggestions that I would like to have but is very likely that at least of today I have no community support and thus it´s demand is quite low.

 

-Big 4 (and other defensive sides).

As noted in another thread by joepinion. The community has grown a disdain for the big 4 (Ellien, Grognack, Oldin, Tacullu). The claim of the why vary, but I think that is because they are great defensive sides, and defensive is more powerful than offense right now in SW. And despite the claims that more factions will solve that, I just disagree.

The solution the community has been using is either banning or just restricting how often you can pick these factions.

 

I disagree with the community that the best solution is not to just ban or restrict every faction that plays defense. But attacking the problem at it´s core. The problem at it´s core imo is the power of walls in the game.

Personally I´ve tried two rules, sometimes combined to deal with these problems. 

1) Restrictive walls: Right now walls can be placed anywhere on your side of the map too easily. The obvious restrictions is to not allow wall placement on the edges of the map, which are favorite spots for these defensive factions. However I found this is often not good enough. And additionally restriction is required, be either not allowing also wall placement adjacent to enemy walls, enemy cards, friendly walls or/and friendly cards. 

 

2) Sluggish walls: Im gonna start to say that this has been an extremely unpopular optional rule for people on the online community, and based on the interactions on some new cards, I can see why.

But I sometimes Try the rule that walls, instead of needed rolled dice for a hit, automatically get wound markers the same way The tundra orc smasher works

 

The overall point is that instead of alienating people from using these 4 factions. An optional rule to weaken wall and thus weaken their extremely powerful defenses would be more interesting to have as an option.

 

*****

I will end this post with 2 rules I use in my live games but that I do not expect community support for them, however if it´s really easy to implement, maybe there is some hope to ever seem them as optonal rules.

 

1) Move the draw phase AFTER the event phase:

In my experience when the draw phase is after the event phase, it requires a very interesting decision in the build magic pahse, since what you have in hand is all that is gonna be available. I think its a very intersting and fun optional rule but doesn´t intend to solve any ¨problem¨ with the game.

 

2) Instead of 0 cards in hand, players start with 5 cards in hand. Second player starts with 2 extra cards. Before the game starts the player must place two of them in magic pile: 

Again this is a very personal optional rule. But a common complain I have with people is that they find the first turn dull since after playing a few times it´s always the same in each matchup. This makes every first turn different since depending on your starting hand you will play different. It also reduces the advantage of the second player.

 

 

***

Final note: I think some of the optional rules first discussed really would benefit the tournament scene and I think I will get support. Others are just very personal preferences that are gonna be more controversial if it´s worth to even have as optional rule (I don´t know what is the cost or effort of adding each optional rule). That I think also improve the game but I don´t know if I will get support.

I hope that at least some of the more important ones see the light of day.

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